If I may, let me play Devil\'s Advocate here. I have enjoyed Kipper\'s stories of Zimbabwe, know Pippa travels all over Africa as many others do.

What makes one decide to go to the southern African countries despite the fact that they may have poor wildlife policies? Many of them have hunting, canned lion hunting, sell their ivory thus encouraging more poaching.

Personally I would rather my travel money go to a country that is trying to make a difference. For instance, Kenya doesn\'t allow hunting, won\'t sell their ivory and is TRYING to cut down on poaching. I would rather my money \'reward\' them for their good policies rather than to other countries.

Please jump on board here and let us know what makes you decide to go to countries that may not have the best wildlife conservation policies.

I would say to get an insight of what is happening. You leave the country visited with new "personal and direct" ideas and are able to express your own opinion of what is going on - this may lead up to changes.
I personally believe to say No to a place without having 1st hand knowledge is the easy way out!
All what you have mentioned above what Kenya is trying to do or has changed policies in the past is because people like you have travelled to Kenya and expressed their concern which has been then taken into account on a global stage.

I wish I could be a positive as you Cody thinking that perhaps one could make a difference and help bring about positive change. I've made some suggestions to KWS that would definitely improve the life of wildlife such as having patrols in the parks at the time of game drives to prevent the 30 car rush to view lions but you get no where and nothing is done. As long as they are making the money thru parks fees or lodge/
camp payments they aren't inclined to make changes. It is when they are hurting such as after the clashes that they then begin to think "what could we do differently to bring people back". Thus the government reducing visa fees by $25.00.

Well Jan that's a can of worms you opened here!

If hunting is your only criteria for your Safari destination may I ask why you return to America after each trip to Kenya?
Along with hunting, trapping (Snares?) is still legal in some states!!!

Also you yourself highlight the corruption of Kenya & recently infered in a post that Chinese diplomats were selecting their ivory on the hoof so to speak!!!

Here are my reasons to visit Zimbabwe, Botswana & Zambia.

No hotel excursions from the coastal resorts!
The tourists you meet there are wildlife enthusiasts not on a three day - see everything - Hows my suntan? - Any more ice? - Where's the swimming pool? - Can we see the Leopard now? trip.

I would add that my first ever trip was thus, although a sun tan & the beach have never been my thing! But I got the African bug & wanted to experience more than the soft protected world of the organised tours.

I love the bush, I love the soletude, I love to stake out a water hole & wait all day!
I love laying in my tent knowing that I am the only human for miles around, I love being the only vehicle with a pride of lions, I love sitting & having an elephant scratch himself on the Landrover while we sit with bated breath in awe of his majesty.
I love driving in areas where there has not been a vehicle for years! (I would add that we were requested to so by rangers to deter cross boarder poaching)

I love to meet the people in the villages to barter even to watch my punctured tyre as it is mended so it's not switched with an inferior one.
I have camped with Masai in Tanzania far away from the tourist routes, eaten with them joked with them my video camera was a great sourse of enjoyment to them on playback.

In Zimbabwe everyone in conservation is so pleased you have visited, why should I hand the wildlife over to the hunters?

Here are a couple of stories to show why I will continue to support these people besides the pure enjoyment I get from my trips.

one ranger was charged with the care of waterhole pumps, one pump in particular was very tempermental so he built himself a shelter so he could base himself at this pump, if he could not fix it he would sleep in the bush as the elephants would pester him if the water did not flow! He had not been paid for 4 months!!

Another on the day of his wifes funeral ensured that his campsite was clean before he buried her! Again it was a number of months since he'd been paid.

Black Rhino had been released into Hwange 3 rangers lived off the land as protection for the rhino, I am told they also had not been paid for some time.

Besides the pure pleasure my wife & I get from these trips we are showing our support to these dedicated people.... & we just love meeting
Benson every year!!

Welcome back Kipper. We've missed you.

I didn't mean to open a can of worms. I wasn't critizing you. I just wanted people's honest opinions as to why they travel to one country rather than another in selecting your safari destination to countries that may not have the best wildlife policies. You and Pippa have been to far more countries than most of us and would be in a better position to explain things.

You have stated some interesting and legitimate reasons why you prefer Zim rather than other countries and I agree with you on a lot of them. For a female traveling alone it would probably not be the safest thing to do, nor do I know if I would be brave enough to have an elephant sit on the bonnet or see some of the things you have And, you are talented enough that if a vehicle broke down you would be able to fix it yourself.

Do you feel that by continuing to go there you are in essence giving your approval of their horrible human and wildlife policies? If people boycotted destinations where people didn't care about their wildlife would it make a difference? For instance, South Africa still talks about culling huge herds, and yet when the word gets out with people all over the globe against South Africa, the talk of culling quickly stops.

Glad to read your side of the issue. You almost convinced me.

Yes I did worry about my first trip to Zimbabwe, were we safe, were we right to, in effect support, the government?
All I can say is yes! We have met so many dedicated people that our support / visit means so much to them.

Even though I have not bought or read a newspaper for 25 -30 years I still heard & feared all the hype given out by journalists, Newspaper, TV & radio reporters as full of their own importance they spread negative propoganda destroying all with their poisoned words & distorted facts.

Why do they not highlight the proposed wildlife corridore between parks & countries with the removal of fences?

I'm glad I was able to ignore their rantings & booked my first trip with Fiona, Benson & Ngoko Safaris.

I have never felt threatened, intimidated or in danger by the people, police, army or government officials.

All have been most welcoming & helpful & in some cases inviting us to take tea with them.

I do not believe in boycott, if you do not have contact how can you influence peoples thoughts or debate the issues that are important?

Yes there are a number of unethical tourist traps in Zim & SA, walking with lions being one, but a quick peek at YouTube shows that the tourists at these ventures are youngsters & easily taken in by the "Conversation" Hype. Only by our support to the true conservationists do we stand the chance to influence their actions & highlight the true future & death for these lions!
Whome when too big to walk with tourists they are shipped to the SA auctions & the private parks for the Canned lion industry.
But even here legislation is changing for the better & I'm sure it is not the canned lion industry & it's scum clients that have forced this legislation!

Without the trickle of tourists into the country I'm not sure that the conservationists would still have the heart to continue & if that happened what would be the outcome of the wildlife?

On a seperate subject my thanks go to Simba & Cody for Bushdrums & to the forum.
It is a special site where we all can disagree yet, unlike some sites, we respect each others different view & remain friends.
We may not have the member base of some sites or their knowledge base but I have yet to see a personal attack within the forums......
Hmmmm!
I lie!
Cody???????